SPEAKER_00: 0:04

Welcome to the Brilliant Fertility Podcast. I'm your host, Dr. Katie Rose, and this podcast exists to help illuminate the path ahead of you. With expert interviews, clinical pearls, and real client success stories, my intention is to bring you hope for what's possible on this journey and to give you tools and resources to navigate the ups and downs on the road before you. If you find this podcast helpful, don't forget to subscribe on your favorite listening platform. And I have a big request. If you have a minute, can you leave us a five-star review? And let us know what did you learn, what did you come away with? Did you leave with that spark of hope? This helps more people like you find the podcast. My mission is to support as many humans as possible on their path to become parents. And by you sharing and subscribing, you're part of that mission too. And I'm so grateful for you for being here. Welcome back to the Brilliant Fertility Podcast. I'm so excited about our guest today, my friend and colleague Madison Wagner. Thank you for being here, Madison. I am just I'm really excited. I know I invited you like over a year ago to be on the podcast. So this feels like finally down. Yes. And we get to share about all of the brilliant wisdom that you have around Ayurveda and fertility. So for our listeners, Madison is a compassionate Ayurvedic doctor and natural fertility specialist dedicated to helping women prepare their mind and body for the journey of pregnancy. And what I love about what you do, which I feel like just parallels so much of my work as well, is blending this Ayurvedic wisdom with cutting-edge functional hormone science so that people can feel really empowered on their journeys. So thank you for being here. I'm going to warn both of all of our listeners that both of us have our dogs here with us today. They really, really wanted to be present for the podcast. So if you hear little doggy noises, it just is what it is. It's dog medicine. So embrace it.

SPEAKER_01: 2:24

So true.

SPEAKER_00: 2:38

So true. So I am honored to have you here. And I'm always curious. I don't know that you and I have ever really dived into how you got into this work in the first place. Like what brought you to Ayurvedic Medicine?

SPEAKER_02: 2:56

There's dog on my dog, doggy jump energy. Yeah, first of all, I'm so excited to be here. And it has been a long time coming. I know you invited me, like you said, over a year ago, and just really excited to be here and you know talk, connect with you and talk with you and share more about, you know, we do our worlds intersect a lot. And I'm really excited to talk about that. But um, so you know, more about me and my story. So I, you know, my own health issues is what brought me to Ayurveda. Um, in my early 20s, I was struggling. I didn't have a period for many months. Um, I was struggling with really bad acne, really bad digestive issues. I also had a really difficult relationship with food. And um, you know, my the doctor recommended birth control as well as Accutane. And at that point, I was like, okay, yes, you know, I'll do it, thinking that I was, you know, really supporting myself. Um, the Accutane helps my skin, and I thought the birth control was helping with my menstrual cycles, which were, you know, very irregular. Um, come to find out they weren't actually supporting, right? It was just band-aiding what was happening. So once I stopped Accutane, my acne came back. Um, and right around that same time as when I learned about Ayurveda through yoga teacher training. And I started to learn more about, you know, why digestion is so important and really how to support my unique body type, understanding that, you know, there's different mind body types, like, how do we really support the individual? Not like, you know, here's this one thing for everybody. Um, and so I started applying those principles in my own life, and I started to feel so much better. And like I was started to cultivate this um, you know, inner radiance and glow, um, supporting my digestive tract. My skin started to clear, um, my my menstrual cycles, you know, became regular. And I just felt so much better. And I also really, you know, healed my relationship with food, which is so important. Um, so I yeah, that was kind of like the you know, the tip of learning about Ayurveda. And for those of you who are not familiar with Ayurveda, it translates to the knowledge or the science of life. I call it the like the OG holistic healing system. So it's a 5,000-year-old healing science that really supports mind, body, and spirit. Um, and so I, you know, I've I as soon as I learned about it, I was like, wow, this is incredible. Like I have to start studying. So I started studying right away, and I've been studying um here in the United States, um, in India, and um yeah, I've been practicing since I think 2016, 2017. Um, so for many, many years and have worked a lot with women's health. I became a mom in 2022, and that was a really transformative journey to focus more on, you know, um preconception and fertility and really, you know, getting to the root of what's happening. And that's when I also started studying um functional hormone science too. So, you know, motherhood was just a big transition. I think right before our first son was conceived, I was struggling with a lot of digestive issues. And um, you know, right after he was born, I developed else palsy, which is facial paralysis. And I think a lot of that was like depletion prior to getting pregnant. Um, and you know, I was able to heal that quickly, thank goodness. I'm, you know, very, very grateful using Ayurveda, traditional Chinese medicine, to help heal. And then in 2023, we had a near-death experience with our son where we almost lost him. I feel like that really opened me up to this, you know, the I've been a spiritual person for a long time, but just this like intersection of you know, life and death, and how um there, there's it's it's just such like a you know, a precipice. And I feel like we don't talk about that and really like honor the deepness of creating and cultivating life. And you know, a lot of my focus is on preconception, you know, fertility support too, but really educating like why preconception is so important, not just you know, in for getting pregnant, for having a good, healthy pregnancy, and then also really supporting you know your child and diving into this idea that you know there's there's three for conception. There's you know, two two parents and baby soul. And I feel like that's so important. Um, you know, in in this moment where we weren't sure if he was going to, you know, I I could feel his soul. So after he was born, he never he developed viral meningitis at five days old. And I truly could feel his soul deciding if he was going to stay or if he was going to go. And it was so difficult, but I was like, you know, this wasn't up to me, right? I, as mom, called him in and here he was, and it's like, but this journey was also his too. And he had to make the choice to stay. And that just completely, you know, blew the doors open for you know the possibilities. And um yeah, just doing this, you know, really deep work, supporting clients in this yeah, beautiful.

SPEAKER_00: 7:50

That I think so many of us were totally unprepared for how that would split things wide open. And I know for many of our listeners who are feeling the pressure, the grief of not being mothers yet, like they're aching for that experience. But also I hope that all of you can just take some hope in that you're you're hearing this all first because it's a part of your preparation into conscious parenthood. And so for you to share your experience of you know being depleted in that first pregnancy and postpartum, having this near-death experience, and like there could be so much discomfort talking about life and death, but like we're we're in the trenches of this together as threshold workers as facilitators. And I I would love to hear more if you're open to sharing about like what that felt like for you being in communication with your son's soul as he was making that decision. Like, do I stay or do I go? Like, what did that actually look like and feel like and sound like for you?

SPEAKER_02: 9:10

Yeah. Yeah, I think you know, I I feel like I have this intuitive sense, right? And sometimes it's hard to like pinpoint that, but it's just like this felt sense. And um what's I didn't share this part, but what's wild was uh around at the start of my third trimester, I actually had a dream. And prior to our first son, too, I had a dream that he was that you know, he was coming. He's like, he's ready. And we know we weren't quite ready yet, but like he was like, Hey, I'm kinda like, I'm coming. And like there, you know, there it there it happened. Um with our second son, I had a dream at the very beginning of my third trimester that he was going to come and I couldn't stop him. And sure enough, a few weeks later, that's exactly what happened. Um, so at 34 weeks, I developed I got a virus, I started preterm labor, it stopped. Um, I had to get induced. So at 35 weeks, he was born and then he got sick after that. So, you know, I think there's there's this way that our children can communicate with us, um, you know, if we're open to that. But for me, dreams is a really big part. Um, when he was, you know, after he got sick, which he was born at 35 weeks and he was doing really, really well, we were gonna take him home, you know, day five, then he stopped eating. And it's like, okay, something's wrong with him, like, you know, what's going on? And that's when, you know, we figured out what was going on. But there was just um, you know, just this intuitive felt sense of like this is it's his, right? It's like I did everything I could, and his his entrance into the world and how things played out was like this is also his karma. And um I would whisper in his ear, Caden, we need you. I need you. Mama needs you, your brother needs you, your daddy needs you, like we need you here. That makes me emotional right now. It's been a while since I talked about that. But like how you know, it's like we need you, like we have to call your soul here because we know we love you. And it was such a difficult experience. Like, wow, like I grew this child, I birthed this child, I might lose this child. But you know, if that was our journey, that would be our journey, right? Like, that's you know, that I believe that souls have, you know, their life experiences. And if that was the experience that he had to have, like, God, that would be really fucking hard. But okay, you know, like that's his, right? So there's just so much surrender in that moment. It's like, there is all I can do is be here for him. I was very adamant about nursing and giving him milk fresh every time, being around him, so that my body, like our, you know, our bodies are incredible. Like my body can create antibodies, right? Western medicine was keeping him alive, but like what was actually supporting is like breast milk can do that. And so I was very adamant about that and supporting him in the ways that I could. I was putting, um, you know, he had viral meningitis. I was putting, there's a practice in Ayurveda to anoint the head with oil, and I was putting breast milk on his head, right, to help support his brain and his nervous system. So, what you know, having this toolkit was actually just so helpful for me. And, you know, being able to support him in the ways that I could, and I was like, what can I control? And what do I need to let go of? And focusing on what I could control, and you know, loving on him and you know, letting the rest unfold, which is a really difficult place to be.

SPEAKER_00: 12:23

It it sounds like an impossible place to be. And yeah, yet you had tools that allowed you to handle that with as much. I don't know, I don't even know how you would uh phrase it. Grace and poise and surrender. I mean, surrender truly is that key word here that I think is such a difficult thing to conceptualize. But when you're in the moment and you feel what that feels like, it's like, oh, that's it. And it's both the hardest fucking thing you'll ever do and the most liberatory thing you'll ever do.

unknown: 13:05

Totally.

SPEAKER_02: 13:06

Yeah. I remember my friends were asking, like, how are you doing this? And like, I I don't have a choice, right? Like, my life has prepared me for this moment, and I'm so grateful that I have all of these tools. And, you know, this is it, right? This is just the way that life is unfolding right now. And yeah, just like deep true, deep surrender. And it's hard. But it's possible. And I think that that's so important to remember too. Like, you know, it it is possible, and there's so much freedom that can come from that place too.

SPEAKER_00: 13:40

Absolutely. It's everything. And then having that life experience, like, how do you feel like it informed your practice and how you support people who are struggling with fertility or just getting curious and leaning into the idea of conscious conception?

SPEAKER_02: 14:00

Yeah, yeah. So you know, really looking at like taking this holistic approach. I think so often we're we're focused on the body, and yes, the body is very important, right? The body is the vessel, the vehicle that carries baby, and there's you know, physical manifestation that happens, but there's also you know, the the mental, you know, the emotional and the spiritual piece too. So it really is a very holistic calling in of you know, the baby, making sure, and and Ayurveda has this beautiful framework. Uh, and it's you know, Ayurveda is 5,000 years old, so this has been around for a long, long time. And it's like it just makes so much sense. What I love about Ayurveda is the principles make sense. But this idea of cultivating a garden, and you know, there's four main aspects that you need to create a garden, and that is the soil. So, what are you going to plant in? Um, you know, what is the quality of the soil? Um, nourishment, so like you know, fertilizing the soil, as well as how are you going to continue to like water or support the soil so it's not too dry, not too wet. Um, looking at seeds, when we talk about seeds, you know, we're talking egg and sperm, and it is a 50-50 that's really important. And then the last piece is time or timing. And that, you know, that can be, you know, the micro and the macro, but you know, are you trying at the right time? Like what season of life are you in? Um, what season in the year is it? What's happening in the world, right? And like all of these things are so important to creating life. And I feel like, you know, this really when you start to dive into it, there's um it can feel well, one, I want to say that fertility, preparing for pregnancy can feel so nebulous. It's like, what does this mean? I know I should be doing all of these things, and when we boil it down into something that we can really understand, that the mind can conceptualize, I think it makes preparation much easier. Um, I'm gonna I'll pause there.

SPEAKER_00: 15:58

Yes, I think that's a really good place to just kind of expand upon the idea of preparing for pregnancy. And most of the people who come to me have already crossed a lot of T's and dotted a lot of I's, including maybe already having been through IVF, already having unsuccessful embryo transfers, having tried acupuncture, having tried like a little here and a little there, but most of them have not done what I would consider like a truly holistic path to this preparation. And yet they're they're so wound tightly and burnt out by the journey that it's you know, the thinking the rewinding to like you can't go back to two years ago from when they started, but we have to meet you where you are now and calm the mind and the body and the spirit and calm that safety. So I guess where I'm going with this question is in the ideal world, at what point would people start thinking about the preparation for pregnancy?

SPEAKER_02: 17:07

Yeah, in a very ideal world, you know, six months, a year away from trying to conceive. And there is a process in Ayurveda, you know, there's a sequence that we like to follow. And, you know, going back to this garden analogy, what's this, you know, what are you gonna be planting in? What's happening in the soil? And do we need to clear the soil? Do we need to deeply nourish the soil? And I find, you know, in Ayurveda, digestion is so, so, so key. Um, it is it's the root. So, you know, it's like we're not what we eat, we are what we digest, right? So we can be eating all the good foods, but we're not actually like digesting and absorbing the nutrition. Um and there's this beautiful concept in Ayurveda, it's it's called the seven dotus or seven tissues in the body. So there's the digestive process and then there's seven tissues, and it's like a cascade effect for one tissue to be nourished and then it goes to the next and the next and so on. Um, and we're looking at things like you know, rasa, or we call plasma, um, rockta, that's red blood cells, mamza, that's muscle tissue. Um, we're talking about fat tissue and bone tissue, um, nervous system tissue. And the very last tissue to be nourished is reproductive tissue. And when I first learned about that, I was like, wow, that makes a lot of sense, right? There's, you know, if our body's based in survival, reproduction is going to be um, you know, it's it's not going to be prioritized, right? It goes on the back burner. So in too, like reproductive tissue, I think, is like the fruit of our essence, right? It's, you know, think about um, you know, seeds. It's like that literally is the next, you know, it becomes the next generation. That's exactly what's happening in our bodies. And um, so you know, really focusing on digestion is so key. So that's like the first piece in the sequence is making sure you can digest something. If you if you can't, which, you know, candidly, most everyone has digestive issues. And I feel like that's really important to address first. Um, because you can be eating all the right things and taking all the supplements, but if you can't digest it, it does not matter. So we start there, we clear, and then we focus on deep nourishment, right? And you know, with the functional hormone science, like we know that the the final maturation, you know, like the the most prominent time for eggs is like you know, 90 to 120 days. So, like, you know, whatever nutrition is in your body, right? So if you're having digestive issues, you're not your body's not going to be receiving that full nutrition. So we want to clear that first so that you know, those last few months prior to conception, you're really, you know, deeply bathing your eggs, your your uterus, your uterine lining, and really, you know, blood becomes the carrier for nutrition. But um, you know, yeah, we want to bathe with as much nutrition, nutrient dense foods as we possibly can. Um and you know, there's certain signs that we look for in Ayurveda that are let me go back to so there's the dot is the seven tissues, and after that, we We create something called OJAS, OJAS. And that is the product of the byproduct of perfect digestion. It is immunity. It is vitality. It is this like strength and radiance. And you know, when we feel that in our bodies, it's like when we're feeling healthy and alive, and wow, that is a sign of fertility too. But again, you know, you can't just get there. It's like you, there's this step-by-step process to get us there. And there are certain foods and herbs that can really support reproductive tissue and you know, creating cultivating ojasts. Um, one that that is one food that is very helpful for supporting all of the tissues is milk. And Ayurveda, cow's milk is said to be given freely to nourish. So, you know, drinking high-quality cow's milk warm with spices is one of the best um Ayurvedic remedies that we'll we will use to support in creating, you know, vitality, supporting um supporting egg health, sperm health, and just feeling vital.

SPEAKER_00: 21:05

And I'll pause you there because I am sure there are some people out there who are having a little bit of a freakout hearing that cow's milk is supportive because they have been fed a lot of information about how dairy is inflammatory and it's oh god, I see these goddamn ads on Instagram that are like fertility killer, fertility killer, and like one of them is like, you know, someone pouring a glass of milk and it's just infuriating because you know that's not rooted in science or individualized consideration. So I think that's so fascinating that you know we have a system that has 5,000 years of evidence saying that, like, oh yes, indeed, this can be a fertility superfood when used properly under guidance.

SPEAKER_02: 21:56

Yes, exactly. When used properly, under supervision. It's yeah, it's it's funny because I'm like a few years ago, you know, many years ago, it's like dairy, gluten, it's like there's so many things, but it's like going back to this idea with digestion, a lot of the re you know, a lot of the reason is that people can't digest it, right? Milk, lactose can be very difficult to digest. But the the thing is that we never fix the root issue, which is digestion, right? It's like we want to start there and to really, you know, in Ayurveda we talk a lot about agni, a G N I, which means digestive fire. And if our fire is low, it doesn't matter what we put on the fire, we're never actually gonna burn it down. And I think that that image is so helpful to be like, well, you know, how does digestion work? The more that we optimize it, get it really strong, we put food on the fire, it you know, it it burns. And then um, yeah, and we want to keep doing that process. If we're constantly snacking throughout the day, we're like killing our fire off.

unknown: 22:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 22:54

And that's so interesting. So I wonder, you know, so say some someone comes in and they have a lot of you know reported food sensitivities and the oh, I can't eat this and I can't eat that. And the list goes on, and where does one start with them in the system of Ariveda?

SPEAKER_02: 23:12

Yeah. That's a good question. So, you know, working with digestion, so figuring out what is in the realm of like what's something they can eat. Um, we focus a lot on like cooked and easily digestible foods. That's really important. Um, I used to be a big salad girly, smoothie girly, and you know, someone mentioned this once, like smoothie, uh drinking a smoothie is like trying to digest cold cement. Like it's freaking hard to do. And I'm like, it's you know, smoothies are these superfood, but it's it's very difficult for your body to break down. Um, you know, on that tangent too, I'm like, same thing with like protein powders. Protein powders, like, you know, get your protein in. Yes, protein's important, but what is the source? What is the quality? That can actually be more difficult for your body to break down and digest. Um, but there, you know, there's you know, I will tend toward using a few things. So one, mung beans, mung beans are very easily digestible. So, you know, taking a simple diet for a day, maybe a few days, can actually be incredibly beneficial for resetting your digestive function. I use the example of a pipe, right? If you're not digesting and your pipe starts to get clogged, you know, we have to do the plumbing or clear those pipes out. And that is true for um, you know, deep nourishment to your tissues, also for hormones, right? If something's covered, there's not that clarity of you know hormonal communication. So when we do that, it can actually be incredibly beneficial. Um, for those who don't who you know who can't eat beans, I will also use meat, so like meat soup, um, you know, chicken and veggies, just cooked, simple, um, can be profoundly transformative. And, you know, how do you know, especially with digestive stuff, um, you can look at your tongue in the mirror and see if there's a coating on your tongue. Maybe you do that too.

SPEAKER_00: 24:53

Um, that is one of the main diagnostic tools of traditional Chinese medicine as well.

SPEAKER_02: 24:58

Yeah, yeah. And it's, I mean, it's pretty profound. Like there's so much information you can get from looking at your tongue. It's it's great. But you know, look in the mirror and see if you have a white coating. Sometimes there's a color to the coating, but that's a sign of again those like clogged pipes that things aren't, you know, the communication, the nutrition is not working. So if you find yourself in that place like, I'm doing all these things, but you know, it's not working, things, the the needle's not moving, you know, we need to go back and and focus on you know clearing and gentle. It's not, you know, it it can there are a lot of cleanses out there that can be incredibly, you know. Uh juice cleanse, for instance, is a great example where that that can completely put your digestive fire out. If you put a bunch of water on a fire, your the fire goes out. Same thing with your digestive system. But if we strategically take foods that are very nourishing, very easily digestible, the body gets a break. So it's not focusing on digestion and can go and do some clearing and some plumbing.

SPEAKER_00: 25:54

Yeah. Um, I love bringing up the juice cleansing because I remember I think I was, I must have been a third-year medical student. And like we as a class, we had all watched some documentary that like we were like, oh my god, we all need to be like vegan juice cleansing 24-7. And so I was in the midst of doing this juice cleanse. And I went to see my acupuncture and he felt my pulses and he looked at my tongue and he was like, What have you been doing? And I was like, I've been, I'm like maybe five days into this juice cleanse. And he was like, Oh, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. Go home, eat cow. I was like, Oh, tell me more. And he was like, Well, everything that you're putting in your body is just cold, cold, cold, cold. It's impossible to digest. And he was he was very grateful that he caught me five days in instead of like the full three weeks that we were all supposed to be doing. He was like, no, go get a roast, slow cook it, put some root veggies in there. And I was like, oh, okay. I have some learning to do here. And and yes, I mean, through my additional training with TCM and you know, hearing you talk about the way Ayurveda utilizes nutrition, it sounds like we really have something to learn from these ancient masters.

SPEAKER_02: 27:19

I know there's something like there's just something about it that makes a lot of sense. And I think I really love that because it can simplify things that feel so nebulous or so complex to just make it very understandable and very digestible. Um literally and figuratively.

SPEAKER_00: 27:40

Yes.

SPEAKER_02: 27:42

Yes, and I there's just something about that that's also so empowering, right? Like medicine, fertility can feel so disempowering. And when we start to understand, you know, our bodies are unique. So some of us are gonna have more fire or you know, more earth, or more water. And when we understand that and can use foods, use the qualities of foods as medicine, so much can unlock for us, right? And and it's like, you know, for some people, they might be able to get away with having more salads. For those who are what we call more vata type, have a lot of you know, air in space, their digestion is irregular, you know, they're tend towards dryness, toward anxiety. Having like salads and smoothie is, you know, poison, it can be poison, literally, right? And I think that's really important, is like anything can be medicine, anything can be poison. It really depends on how it's used.

SPEAKER_00: 28:32

Yeah, so you mentioned the types, and that's something I've always been really curious about. Um, yeah. So we have the three types within Ayurveda, right? But you've also identified that there are fertility types as well. How are you is evaluating for those types? What are you looking for to help identify that?

SPEAKER_02: 28:55

Yeah. So essentially, you know, understanding the the elements again and how they can manifest in your body. So um earth and water is one type, and we call that coffee, K-A-P-H-A. And you know, coffee types are generally going to be um, you know, larger boned, larger eyes, like thick, full hair. As far as cycles, um, they can be a little bit longer. They might notice that their digestion's a little bit slower, um, you know, feeling like a little bit more sluggish. Also, um, yeah, like what else, what else to share? Um, let me go to pitta. So pitta is mostly fire with a little bit of water. Um, but pitta types are generally, you know, medium, medium bone, can be more athletic, more muscular. Um, they can be more fiery, so like firing personality, very like goal-oriented, very directed. Here's what I'm doing. Um, they can tend toward like rash, redness. Um, you know, menstruation can be more um like like more burning, um, can be like bright red. And generally, you know, pitdas are can be like clockwork with menstrual cycles. Um, and then vata types. So vata is air in space, that's V-A-T-A. And that relates to, you know, again, well, we have the the larger bone, the medium, and so vata types are going to be like more, you know, thinner bone, thinner eyes, thinner hair, maybe tending towards dryness. Um, and cycles can be irregular. So we think about air in space, how that can have more irregularity. Um, yeah, you know, in and menstruation can be more scanty. So we're just seeing, you know, less blood flow. So just understanding your body type can help you, you know, bring hormones into balance, eat foods that really nourish your body type. And again, we're focusing on qualities, which I think is really different than just general like eat healthy advice.

SPEAKER_00: 30:55

Yeah, and I think it can also apply to say you have someone come in with the Western diagnosis of PCOS, right? And they're given this blanketed advice. You need to take metformin and you'll need ovulation induction, and you know, blah, blah, blah. But then you might have someone who comes in with that lean type PCOS who would be more on the Vata pattern, or or you could have someone who has the more stereotypical appearance of PCOS who might be on the more KAFA pattern. Am I Yep. Is that okay?

SPEAKER_02: 31:31

Yeah. And I think that's yeah, that's so important because like you can come, you know, you can someone can get diagnosed with something, but the way that it manifests can be very different based on you know bioindividuality too. Like you're talking about, like PCOS is a great example of that.

SPEAKER_00: 31:45

Yeah. I and I'm sure it applies to so many other conditions within uh men women's health and menstrual patterns and fertility patterns. So when someone comes to see you, like what's the first step? Like, what does that actually look like on their journey using Ayurveda with you?

SPEAKER_02: 32:06

Yeah, it's a great question. So um, you know, doing just a complete intake, right? And really understanding that everyone is a unique individual, right? And like life story really plays part into that. And so really understanding like you know, the mind, body, spiritual aspects of um an individual and their life and what's brought them to you know this moment and the you know their health patterns, etc. But a lot of times, you know, digestion is the first place that we will we will work, making sure that digestion is clear and then um really focusing on nourishment and nutrition. Herbs definitely use a lot of herbs too. Um there's such a variety of herbs, you know, to doing the the clearing, um, and then focusing on deep nourishment and understanding what's going on hormonally as well. Um yeah, but that's like the general, the general framework. And again, understanding, I think what's so important is like my initial consultation is two hours where I really sit with somebody and understand them as a unique individual, um, you know, looking at tongue and feeling pulse and and just asking a lot of questions. It's like, you know, what do you do first thing when you wake up in the morning? Um, how are you eating your food? Are you sitting to eat? Are you eating on the go? Are you skipping meals? Um, what's your sleep like? How, you know, what time are you sleeping? Are you waking up in the night? Um, how much are you urinating? What do your bowel habits look like? Um, what is the consistency or quality of you know, of your bowel movement? So it's really getting this in-depth understanding and looking at these patterns of like qualities, like I've mentioned quite a few times. Um, you know, there's we can see that like the dryness of the vata can show up in in many ways, right? On the skin, bowel, bowel movements, menstrual cycles. So we just start to see these patterns and really support from that like deep root place.

SPEAKER_00: 34:01

That's really beautiful. I I love a good root system and not just the way the wellness industry is throwing that word around, like there's no meaning to it anymore, which makes me feel sad about the state of our world and the wellness industry in general. So being able to highlight the work that you're doing, which is truly root oriented um feels very aligned with my mission of helping these souls come to the planet in a way that allows them to do their best work here. And I think that's a good segue into like really biting into the concept of conscious consumption. Which I know you and I have talked about and you know, have nerded out about um quite a bit. But what is what does that mean to you? Because I feel like all of us maybe have our own orientation towards that term.

SPEAKER_02: 35:08

Yeah, totally. And I think I think there's so many definitions, and you can come up with whatever different definition resonates with you. I would say for me, conscious conception is like, you know, consciously preparing mind, body, and spirit for welcoming new life. So we've talked about some of the physical things that you know we just mentioned and bringing body into balance so that you know, ready for conception. Um, there's the mental piece too, as we talked about at the very beginning of our conversation, that you know, motherhood is a big portal to walk through. And I feel like we aren't, you know, it's like you just, you know, you just have a baby, like you just get pregnant, have a baby. And it's like, wait, like there's so much that's happening for, you know, for mother. And same thing with father too. And I feel like we don't often talk about that. Like it's this huge transformation, this big identity shift. And like, how are we preparing for that? Um, after the birth of our first son, I had this like huge identity shift, and I'm like, I felt so unprepared for it. And um, yes, it's like, how do we have conversations and prepare? Like, what does that look like? Um, and then you know, the spiritual piece too is like, you know, there is this physical manifestation of our world, but there's also this like spiritual soul side of calling life in. And gosh, you know, there's there's so much to discuss around that, but how are we really truly honoring that? And you know, I think you know, the state of the world, I feel like it's you know, it feels really dire at some, you know, you know, right now things feel really tough, and I feel like that's important. It's like sharing this message. I think we're when we're conscious about things, it's like we want we want to take care of our planet, we want to take care of the people in our community, we want this world to be peaceful, to be loving, right? It's like love is this all per all-pervasive feeling. And how do we call souls into this world who you know want that are like ready to hold that up, right? And I in like this is that consciousness that we can bring, is in Ayurveda too, there's this idea, um, garba sanskar, which is you know the energy of what you're bathing your womb in. So like during pregnancy or even prior to pregnancy, and what kind of energy are you calling in, right? That is your baby's first home. It's like so often we think about you know, I'll focus on what I'm eating when I'm pregnant, but it's like, hey, you, you know, your eggs are getting all of the information, the nutrition, you know, like the DNA is being set months before conception. So you know, there's this consciousness that we bring even to like egg cells and sperm cells. And the more conscious that we are in mind and body, the more that that, you know, that the egg is being bathed in that consciousness. And same thing with womb, right? That you are creating, you know, creating this energy and also, you know, this invitation. How do we, instead of forcing something, how do we create the invitation, right? If you have a dinner party and you like force people to come, like that wouldn't feel good, right? Like, what if you had a dinner party and like, hey, I'm doing this really cool thing? It's gonna be so fun. I'm gonna feed you, I'm gonna keep you warm, and it's gonna be incredible. And like, I'm gonna invite you to this thing. It's like, oh, that sounds way better, right? And how do we do that? How do we bring this energy into preparing for pregnancy? And I feel like there's, I think this is like a really, you know, a different conversation and concept to bring is like, you know, why is this so important? And um, how do we bridge this like East and West to be like, well, you know, scientifically, here's what's happening, here's why it's so important to support your egg health, right? You're literally creating, you know, the DNA of your child months before you conceive. And, you know, that is setting their foundation. And and also, you know, not just the next generation, but like generations. There's research that literally generations are impacted in that few-month window before conception. But um, you know, also that like energetic um, you know, consciousness piece too is like what how are we creating a really warm, welcoming space for our child?

SPEAKER_00: 39:49

Yes. And my my conversations around this have shifted maybe more in the last few years as well. As I, you know, I I think for me starting off in the whole. World, there was a stronger emphasis on the physical and the mental. And more so in the last, I would say, five to six years, I've there's just been this undeniable pull towards addressing the emotional and the spiritual. And I think in the past I I was more focused on like how do we protect your emotions, how do we protect your energy? How do we create this little bubble of frequency for that invitation? And for me now at least, that has shifted a bit as it's just become like ever everything is so in our faces that to create that bubble is almost feels dishonest. It almost feels untrue. And so that reality of how do we navigate the inviting new life in while we are also facing the deepest evils of humanity and trusting that these souls have purpose and that they know what they're getting into. But how can we prepare as parents, as communities, as villages, in a way that allows them to come do their best work and be loved and be bathed in love?

SPEAKER_02: 41:25

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I think that's, you know, there's reality in that, right? We can have this pie in the sky situation. I feel like, you know, parenting, motherhood has been, has been that, right? It's like it's, you know, it's the start of this is experiencing such extremes, right? Where like, oh my gosh, this is the best thing. And wow, excuse me, this is like the you know, the biggest mirror I've ever had on myself to, you know, to look at your patterns and see what comes up. And I think that that's you know, that's really important. But I think there's also like that is the that is the spiritual evolution. This is the spiritual side of things, is like, you know, life doesn't happen too as it happens for us, for us to grow into this deeper evolution of human being. And to to know that that darkness exists, of course it does, and always will, right? It's like, you know, we don't want to get siloed into there's only this goodness and this light. Like, you know, the darkness is there too. Um and we have to hold both with reverence and with love. And, you know, there's I don't know, like this idea of a soul contract, right? That that I'm entering into this soul contract and like the invitation and the acceptance of the invitation for baby to be like, okay, those are the parents that I'm going to choose. Um, I don't know if you if you know much or um around, I mean astrology, but particularly Jodish or Vedic astrology, which is pretty profound. Um, you know, Jodish is it's literally the the science of light and understanding how you know these larger celestial bodies have different energies. And you know, when when you look at a birth chart, like when you're born, these planets are in different places and they impact different parts of um you know aspects of your life. And it's, I mean, it is profound. I'm not I'm not a dodoshi, I don't read charts, but you know, there are a lot of wonderful people who do and who will specialize in like fertility readings too, to understand like what are the energies for you at different times. Um, but uh you know, I'm gonna weave this back to to my story. But with our son after he was born, I had his chart read, and like his initiation period was the first 18 months of his life. That was literally an initiation period, and it absolutely was, right? How things played out is like this is what he's you know, this is what he chose, this is how things manifested. And um, you know, he had he had to make the decision, right? And it's you know, not by chance, but his name's Caden and it's it means warrior, right? Like it we we we couldn't decide a name he was born, and then it's like okay, this seems appropriate for him, you know. So, but it's you know, I think that there's also um yeah, you know, there there are these these bigger energies at play, but you know, a lot of for all of us, right? Our our souls come here to learn, you know, in the university of life. Like, you know, we we literally are here to learn and to grow. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 44:26

I want to sit with that just for a minute because I think we need to remember sometimes how much wisdom there is even in a tiny little infant who's only been here for five days and really trust that wisdom and the wisdom of our souls having come here at this time and this place and that you know that like soul deep trust is it's hard, right?

SPEAKER_02: 44:58

It's it is hard, it's you know, and I think like that that is life, right? And in like how do we you know sit in that? I think so many of us can try running from it. And instead of running, like what does it feel like to just sit in that, right? To sit in it, to be in it.

SPEAKER_00: 45:23

Oh, I think people are absolutely running from that. They are running wild and the sitting in the discomfort the identifying and processing of the feelings that we feel the shame, the guilt, the anger, the fear. That's a part of it. And it's like at the risk of slowing down and feeling people are freaked out by that. Not all people, but a lot of people the mass of humanity appears to be trending towards that right now. And to be a practitioner who asks people to consciously slow down is like, ooh, all right, how do we set people up for this paradigm shift? Because we're gonna have to get real comfortable with the uncomfortable.

SPEAKER_02: 46:17

Yeah. Yeah, and I think it takes, you know, it takes time, and I think that's important, right? We can't force, right? We can't force the nervous system, but we create the space and we invite and allow the unwinding. Um, but it takes, you know, safety in our bodies. I think what's really interesting about Ayurveda is a lot of the practices are body-based, but there's this idea that you know, we're also, you know, there's this consciousness, right? There's the physical body. There we there's what we call five koshas or you know, five layers to a being. And there's the physical, there's the energetic, the prana maya kosha, the mind, the mental body, the mana maya kosha, the gyana maya kosha, the um, oh my gosh, why am I blinking on the word right now? Um, like the intuitive body, like, you know, like steep wisdom body, and then there's the spiritual body. And they're not connected, and I think, or they're not connected, they're all connected, they're not disconnected. And I think that's so important to remember is, you know, we're we are complex beings, and you know, when we work in one area, other areas will shift too. And I find, you know, physically in my work, I you know, I've been practicing Ayurvedic medicine for many years, but when the physical body is in a state of balance, there's way more capacities to start to work in these deeper layers. But if our body is uncomfortable, right? You can't, it's sitting up straight in a meditation with like no back support is can be torture, legitimate torture, like you know, cross legs, backs, you know, spine long. Um, because our you know, our bodies can scream at us, right? And when we first focus on the body, get the body in a comfortable place, then we have this capacity to go to these higher levels of consciousness, right?

SPEAKER_00: 48:03

Just that it's all connected, right? Is that idea that we cannot separate the physical, the mental, the emotional, the intuitive, the spiritual bodies. Like they are all like they're they're just part of one being. And yet most of us have grown up in this system of Western medicine where not only are we not even addressing the mental and above, we are compartmentalizing the systems within the body. You have a an ist for everything, a gastroenterologist and a reproductive endocrinologist and a neurologist, and that you've got like all of these different subspecialties of the different organs of the body, but like the organs are also communicating with each other too. And it's I feel like it's such the metaphor for even like what we are dealing with in humanity, where everything is just separated. We're not looking at this as a collective. And so when we can look at our body, our beingness, our connectedness as not separate, then we can go even we can go deeper, we can get different results, we can defy the odds in the fertility game where someone's been given this 2% chance of conception, but no one's ever addressed any of what we've talked about over the last 45 minutes.

SPEAKER_02: 49:33

Yeah, yeah. I think that's so important where um hey, let me pause, let me just get him, because he's just on one right now.

unknown: 49:56

Okay.

SPEAKER_00: 49:57

Um we're gonna need to see Franklin. You know that for people watching on YouTube, they're just gonna be like, we need we need to see the Franklin.

SPEAKER_02: 50:05

Okay, he's cute. He's a little black, a little black fluff fluff ball. I'll try to get him over here. Um yeah, and I think, I mean, Franklin, come here. You want to make your debut? Come here. He's like, no, I can I can screen him, show him via the screen. There we go. Hi. He's just a little little fluff ball. Um but yeah, and I think there's evolution, right? Like I just talked about, like it can start in the in the physical, but as you know, as we build on the foundation, there's this capacity to hold more, right? We're not ready to do really deep nervous system work when our body's fried, right? And so it takes this like gentle layering approach to go deeper and deeper. And um, you know, thinking about consciousness and calling in conscious beings, it's like, you know, we also have to raise our vibration. But as we continue to do that, you know, as we continue to have these conversations and to bring this up and understand why this is so important, right? We start to raise awareness, raise consciousness of the collective. And I think that that's really important. But, you know, it's I know you and I talk a lot about frequencies and like how that is so important too. And um, you know, how are we continuing to bring awareness to this? I think that's a really big piece too, is just being aware that this is possible. And how do we continue to support this evolution as individuals so that our collective continue to be can continue to be supported too? Amen.

SPEAKER_00: 51:53

Well, Madison, how do people find you? How would someone begin working with you if they felt that tug towards exploring Ariveta with you?

SPEAKER_02: 52:05

Yeah. So my business is Sri Wellness. That's my website. So Shree Wellness, S-H-R-I-Wellness.com. You can head there and I do discovery calls, so you're welcome to book a call and we can talk and see if it's a good fit to work together.

SPEAKER_00: 52:20

Awesome. And we will link your website in the show notes, and we also have your fertility types quiz to link in the show notes, which like I love a good quiz. Um, it just knows like the little curious mental body that's like, ooh, what am I? And like begin to have a little bit more understanding about what your body patterns are telling us. Um, so I will link that as well. And just such a I I want to say thank you on so many levels. First of all, like thank you for being the type of practitioner who is so deeply curious and open for collaboration. So even just the way that you reached out to me at this point a couple of years ago, um from this place of like, I'm so curious, like we have a you know, a mutual acquaintance, and I'm so curious about what you do, and I would love to collaborate. Like, I fucking love that energy, and I love that about you, and I think that is also part of moving the collective forward. So I appreciate you. I'm so grateful for the work that you do and the way that you approach fertility and hormone health and women's health and collective health. Uh, so thank you for being here today. Thank you for being you. Thank you, Franklin, for being here as well.

SPEAKER_02: 53:50

Thank you for all that you do too, and for providing spaces and conversations. Like you're, you know, you are doing the work, right? You are raising, you are raising the consciousness and educating and sharing this. So thank you.

SPEAKER_00: 54:04

Wow, we're doing it together, sister. Yes. All right, listeners. If you got something out of this episode today, just take a moment to pause, reflect, let us know. Like find us on social media at dr.kitty rose at tree wellness. Um, and just let us know what you took away from this episode. You can also leave a review or rating on your favorite listening platform. And just please know that if you feel like you have tried everything, I guarantee you there is a path that has not been explored, and perhaps Ayurveda is the path for you. All right, until next time. Take care. Sending so much love to all of you.